Two months after meeting with Digeo at CES, I’ve yet to receive a Moxi HD DVR ($800) loaner. In fact, three months after initial retail availability, there hasn’t been a single review. And the AVS silence is unprecedented: “Seems pretty sad that no one on an A/V enthusiast forum like this will admit to taking a chance on this unit.” I’ve never seen a flagship product launch go down like this. Although, given Diego’s long history of under-achievement and broken promises, I shouldn’t be surprised.
Over the weekend I surfed on by the Moxi website to learn what, if anything, is going on. And discovered a redesign that spends a lot of time talking TiVo. A Moxi-TiVo comparison is quite natural given TiVo’s status as the incumbent and really the only other retail cable DVR competitor. However, Google reports over 20 pages of TiVo mentions… which seems a bit excessive. Why not stand on your own merits? Some samples:
- The MOXI HD DVR beats TiVo in so many areas
- TiVo tries the same thing, but fails in the effortless department
- TiVo strikes out by putting their fuzzy, elderly menu right on top of the program you’re (trying) to watch
- TiVo serves ads in their pause feature. Moxi’s is free.
- Then there’s TiVo, brazenly asking you for as much as $12.95 a month for the privilege of using something you already bought
As you might expect, Digeo doesn’t point out Moxi’s (current?) video on-demand shortcomings compared to TiVo’s Amazon VOD (soon in HD) and Netflix streaming. But several of Digeo’s jabs are valid. TiVo’s aging UI still isn’t really optimized for 16:9 HDTVs and various tacked on (HME) apps employ (slow) inconsistent interfaces. I’d also appreciate the eye candy of picture-in-guide (PiG).
Of course, Digeo’s key Moxi differentiation is bundling service versus TiVo’s additional fees (monthly or pre-paid) and ad-serving. As far as the total cost of ownership (TCO), Moxi has put together a chart illustrating that Moxi is less expensive over a four year period. However, they point to the TiVo HD XL… with double Moxi’s storage and cite the MSRP versus the street price. (Currently ~$100 less for TiVo; MSRP=street for Moxi.) So, in reality, the costs are comparable for what you get over this time period. As long as Digeo remains in business to serve guide data.
Regarding the advertising, for many of us, one of TiVo’s initial value props was the ability to bypass commercials. Yet, we’re now confronted by ads all over the UI. However, Digeo’s ad-free sales pitch rings a bit hollow… as they’ve hedged their bets with this fine print found in the footer of every relevant page: “Certain current and/or future features/services provided by third parties may contain advertising.” And even the fee-less nature of the Moxi HD DVR may be finite: “Certain future services may be offered at additional cost.”
My closing thoughts: Digeo’s “Step Aside, TiVo.” and “Goodbye TiVo. Hello, Moxi!” marketing copy brings back memories…
A Digeo copywriter tries to write fluid prose, but fails in the effortless department.
As much as I would like to see TiVo refresh their antiquated UI, I have to admit it is the result of a great deal of refinement and it does get the job done. I agree the HME apps are clunky and dismal, but they have never been central to the unit’s user experience and are easily ignored – even the search app.
The real issue is that Digeo has simply produced something comparable, not something vastly superior to TiVo. I have a two-year old Series 3 unit I’ve upgraded to 1 TB of storage. With a Lifetime subscription on the unit, Digeo would have to give me a very compelling reason to switch platforms. I’m locked into TiVo.
I’ve used Tivo’s for 10 years, I think. I’m personally baffled at the lack of innovation. I don’t have a screenshot to compare, but has the UI of Tivo changed at all?
Moxi may not be the answer, but Tivo obviously doesn’t hear/care that so many blogs and reviews call them out for lack of ‘freshness’. While I may like my Tivo, I’d definitely consider switching, if nothing else to start sending a message to Tivo. I think that’s why Tivo is so stale – there’s nobody else in the game. Throw in their general disregard for us Mac folks, well, it won’t take much for me to jump ship!
I too am locked into my TiVo. I even have been paying monthly on one of my 3 units.
I wouldn’t mind some 16×9 UI enhancements though. I do like the beta search they have been sporting. On my 40″ it looks just fine, however a text size option wouldn’t hurt it. The HD and S3 have yet to get pause screen ads, at least I have not seen any. We have a S2 unit that is used for the Kid Zone, so I have not seen any there as well.
Yes, TiVo could use some improvements, but it would really take some strong, very strong, arguments to get me to switch.
I was pretty surprised by this whole Moxi campaign also:
http://www.wkblog.com/tivo/2009/02/moxi-presents-tivo-comparison-tivo-wins/
@frankfurter, have you tried the new TiVo search functionality? It’s still in beta, but it’s a pretty big change from the current UI. Also I’d argue that the Swivel search functionality was another major improvement for TiVo.
Digeo needs to go back and take a look at their chart. On one of the pages, it says that you have to pay $24.95 to listen to mp3’s on your TiVo. This is true if you want to watch Quicktime, DivX or MKV, but isn’t the case for mp3s. They also leave Yahoo’s traffic and weather plugins off the list while touting their stock ticker functionality. Also I didn’t see any mention of TiVo to go on their comparison table, wonder if that has anything to do with Moxi not offering the same functionality to their customers . . .
I feel like I’m stuck with TiVo simply because TiVo works — and expandable storage. My TiVo’s down right now (possibly due to a breakdown, possibly due to a bad cablecard) and I’ve been using the FiOS DVR…it works okay, but TiVo’s just a little bit more reliable. But if the FiOS DVR had expandable storage enabled, I’d probably ditch TiVo for true whole-home streaming and free on-demand, not to mention a much more eye-pleasing guide.
@Davis Freeburg – the new TiVo search beta is pretty cool, actually, but that needs to be the native UI, not running on a java VM. It’s slow and unresponsive, and there’s no reason the TiVo HD hardware couldn’t handle graphics like that natively.
@RandomRage & @Davis – Yeah, I’ve seen the new beta, but I guess that’s part of my issue. It looks great, but it’s a one-off, slow, clunky, and just doesn’t excite me.
Maybe I just don’t understand the UI development process, but shoot, just give me an updated “Web 2.0” look. I mean, there are 400 different themes for Ubuntu. Is it -that- hard to refresh your UI?
But again, navigating around Tivo-land is a less-than-stellar experience. Some things work great (fortunately the Now Playing / regular viewing routines), and some things suck so bad I avoid them (VOD, search, YouTube, Rhapsody).
Geez man, just slick the whole experience up and I’m happy.
I own three Tivos right now, a Series3 and two HD units. The basic UI may be “old”, but it is functional for the main uses of the device – selecting, recording, and playing back television shows. The Netflix UI even works perfectly fine. But that’s all I use my Tivos for. So I’m happy. I don’t see the NEED to “improve” the UI when I don’t think it is broken.
Would I LIKE an updated UI… sure. I would really like to have the picture-in-guide capability. But it isn’t something I would ever considering switching devices to get.
And I use my PS3 for putting my computer content (video and pictures) onto the TV. Works perfectly from my Mac (thanks to MediaLink).
The only really BIG thing I wish Tivo would do is to create a simple media-extender box. No cable I/O, just a network connection and the TV connections. It could have a small hard drive just to allow for storage of one show at a time copied from the other Tivos in the house (so it can use the existing code that Tivo uses today to stream content from one Tivo to another). I have a TV in my office, and I would love to be able to grab content that is recorded on my other Tivos and pull it down… but I don’t need massive storage or the ability to record anything on that device.
aside from the deserved knocks on TiVo there is one main point here that some dance around.
Diego the company is flat out telling lies to try and come off better. I gave dave a hard time when he showed a slide of Diego’s from CES that completely ignored lifetime for a TiVo and said you paid 12.95 a month. said MOXI was cheaper at 800$ whne a new user could buy a TiVo HD at retail with lifetime for 700$. Now they pile onto that unethical marketing with the tripe that is detailed here. All that has done for me is certify I will never trust the company Diego and thus extremely unlikely to get their products, ever.
Yes, TiVo is a for profit company and acts like it as well but they are not even close to the level Diego has found. What Diego has done here is simply unbleivable. add in that they can not even get a unit in the hands of videophiles on AVS forum let alone reviewers and their fate seems sealed.
I think you are cutting Diego a lot too much slack dave.
Sorry Moxi, another commited Tivo user.
Look, I’m sorry, but I’m not sure Tivo will survive the current market conditions. If Tivo came out now and just before I was going to buy one they axed half their staff? I’d think twice.
Unless Moxi is here in a couple of years, and Tivo continues to lag, I’m not going anywhere. I’ve got multiple Tivo units, use the Amazon VOD service, use the TTG features to get things onto my iPod, use the TCB feature to get Top Gear on my TV. I’m not really left wanting a lot.
If over time Moxi releases a cable VOD/SDV compatible box when Tivo doesn’t have one, and that situation stays true for quite a while, then I might consider it. But I’m highly incented to stay with Tivo, so its unlikely.
While there are plenty of things I would *like* in a Tivo (free space indicator, more tuners, cooperative scheduling, some sort of network box I can move shows to to free up space on the local box — and the network box would have space for lots of drives to add to)… I certainly don’t want/need the UI to change JUST TO CHANGE. What is there now mostly *just works*.
I’d love to see an improvement to the UI for playing mp3s – playlist support (they still show directory file structures, yucck, so early 2000s), album art support, social features (glimpse into other TiVo playlists), etc.
Also, would it be that hard to let you play music while browsing photos…?
I’m pretty stoked about the Moxi interface and features, but with that said I still didn’t jump out and buy one.
As fed up with Comcast’s Motorola DVR as I am, I don’t want to give up the free VOD/HDVOD ability. I’m slightly hesitant to give up “if it’s broke, swap it out” mentality of no financial responsibility. Or if something newer comes out I can just “swap it out” for the newer model.
So what could the Moxi group do to get me motivated to switch? Well they already nailed the UI, How about VOD and SDV integration? Along with searchable VOD. How about lowering the price point? $800 is just too much. Perhaps offer a discount. How long’s the warranty? 3 years should be the minimum.
I do hope that UI’s improve across the board. With all of the XBMC themes out there, Boxee, Moxi, etc… all of these companies be it Cable operators or Tivo, they need to get with the program and start thinking like it’s the 21st century. Hey their only 9 years behind ain’t?
Funny, all the responses are from TIVO owners. Where are the satisfied MOXI owners? The silence speaks more than the thousand or so words from the Tivo crowd.
Whats up MOXI, are you real? I’m interested and looking.
Joe
I’m also interested in the MOXI but heard nothing from anyone that has one. Not even a person from the Company that has experienced it or have had some hours under their belt using it … Nothing!
That tells me I may have to suck it up and PAY TiVo to get reliability and longevity of service.
Playstation doesn’t charge for online gaming and XBOX does but that doesn’t mean it’s superior in any way. I am very satisfied with the service I’ve paid for at Microsoft so I might as well pay for the service I am going to expect with TiVo. Almost all of the TiVo subscribers that commented here are happy and know that TiVo has faults but still provides a consistent product and has so for many years.
I think I am sold on TiVo because I can’t wait any longer to get a HD DVR.
SOLD